The World Thru My Eyes - I speak my mind and man does it like to talk.


OK, so I look forward, hopefully, to build a new PC next year. But as I did some research on what I would like to buy as hardware I find myself confused about the processors I am considering.

My goal is to build a decent rig good enough to play most of todays games (except maybe Crysis) with decent frames per second that does not cost an arm and a leg. Hopefully under $900. However I've been stumped at the CPU point of the build as I find myself looking at 2 CPUs of different models but somehow seem the same and that's where it gets confusing.

Here are the CPUs and their similarities and differences:

CPU Intel Core i7-860 Intel Core 2
Socket Type LGA 1156 LGA 775
Core Lynnfield Yorkfield
Multi-Core Quad-Core Quad-Core
Frequency 2.8GHz 2.83GHz
Cache 8MB 12MB
64 bit Support Yes Yes
Manufacturing Tech 45 nm 45 nm
Thermal Design Power 95W 95W
Hyper-Threading Yes ?
Current Price $289.99 $279.99

Besides the .03 difference in the Frequency and the 4MB difference in the Cache, the only real difference is i7 has Hyper-Threading. But what has me confused is that the i7 is the new kid in town, supposely the best CPU from Intel and the Core 2 has been out for quite some time now so why are these 2 CPUs almost the same price? I would have expected an i7 like this one to be more expensive that a Core 2 with similar specs.

Can someone help me understand why these 2 processor prices are so similar? Are they not that much different after all? Would a Core 2 be just fine for my rig or should I just pay the extra $10 for the i7? Please help. Thanks.

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Comments (Page 2)
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on Dec 30, 2009

I guess that he (as many other non-computer literate people) believe them to be the best because of how it was in the old days of the AMD K.6-2 when AMD were crap. I know people I gamed with not wanting AMD simply because they have had bad experiences with their previous cpu generations.

Or he (and some of the rest of us) had a bad deal with AMD. You only have to be burned once to be twice shy.

Well my last 5 CPU's have been AMD's... and only when power needs required it, did I upgrade... to another AMD. However, that was financial and not because I'd been burned by Intel.  I don't know much about the very early AMD's but my latest is an AMD Phenom II x4 920 and I've been most happy with it.  However, I am not anti-Intel and would go that way if circumstances and the price were right.   Had I been able to afford an i7 based machine at the time (an extra $2400 AUD again), I certainly would have gone that way, given the good reviews I'd read. 

For example, Jafo spent $3000 AUD on his i7 920 build around the same time, whereas the Phenom II 920 upgrade cost me under $600 AUD.  That was for the CPU, a 860w PSU and an extra 2x2gb sticks of Corsair RAM.  Thanks to AM2/AM3 backward compatability I was able to keep the same mobo/original RAM and save myself some cash there.

Anyhow!... @ Dr Guy. Long time no see!!  So 'ow be 'e yer ol' bugger... well n' 'appy, I 'opes??

 

on Dec 30, 2009

Since 2000, I have built 4 computers with AMD processors, and for each build I would buy one of the newest most powerful processors AMD had at the time.  Result was satisfying.

I have just finished my latest rig, and after very extensive research, went with the Core I7 920 (2.66Ghz).  Result was AMAZING, blows my mind everyday.

The Core I7 architecture is the biggest jump for processors since the Pentium came along.

It is absolutely awesome. Benefits include... 4 cores/ 8 threads, EEEEasily Oc'd (it took me 20 minutes to figure out how to get it up to 3.6 Ghz stable, on air w/ aftermarket cooler.), I have run 3 HD videos simultaneously, and still not get to 65% load. 

Good and Bad... runs on (requires) DDR3 RAM.  Fast and a bit expensive these days, all RAM prices have gone up dramatically in the last few months. 

Check out NEWEGG or TIGER DIRECT... read some reviews, try googling CORE I7 reviews, you'll find some good information.

Gone to check some reviews on CORE I7 860...

I'm back,

Yes... the 860 wipes the floor with the Phenom X4, even the CORE I5 beats it in 25 out of 27 tests run by Anand Bench.

Get the 860, or if you can... get a 920 (better cache and more memory bandwidth).

on Dec 30, 2009

Just built one with the i7 860 and am more than satisfied with it.  Slight issue with getting a fan controller as the box comes with 6 fans and not enough headers on the MB and I can't get Soundpackager to work with W7 64 bit, but that is nothing to do with the processor.

on Dec 30, 2009

Get the 860, or if you can... get a 920 (better cache and more memory bandwidth).

My next build will be the i7 920, for sure.  I figure that with a bit of saving and prices coming down some, I'll be able to afford it around April/May 2010.  However, instead of trying to purchase everything in the one go, I'll pick up the case, HDD's, ROM's, sound and graphics cards along the way.  That way it'll just be the CPU, RAM and mobo when the time comes/I've saved enough.

on Dec 30, 2009

I agree with narbytrout. Over 25 years I have used AMD and Intel chips in many of their reincarnations and the integration of the I7 with the hardware architechture and Win 7 64bit is a startling advance over what was. At this moment it is the best choice available.

on Dec 30, 2009

  However, instead of trying to purchase everything in the one go, I'll pick up the case, HDD's, ROM's, sound and graphics cards along the way.  That way it'll just be the CPU, RAM and mobo when the time comes/I've saved enough.

 

This really is not a good way to buy a computer.  Prices on everything for computer components trend downward over time.  If you pick up a graphics card (say, a GTX 260) right now, but pick up the rest of your computer four months later, chances are that the very same graphics card you purchased will be significantly cheaper by the time you actually build your computer.

 

Assuming you aren't the kind of person that will just blow money being saved, it is (almost) always vastly superior to save whatever your budget is, and then spend it all at the same time.

 

The only exceptions being one-time style deals (If you can get a GTX 260 for half of street price today, then do it!)

on Dec 30, 2009

I agree, Intel i7's are the best these days, but AMD wins the price/performance, hands down.   The i7's shining points have more to do with the peripherals than with the CPU cores themselves.   A lot of AMD's engineer talent with the peripherals have probably been diverted to assimilating the ATI acquisition, and now as a result they leapfrogged Nvidia on their video card.   I expect the next round of product announcements, AMD will leapfrog Intel again, and Nvidia will leapfrog ATI again.  It's just like a basketball game, trading baskets.

I've pretty much decided I'm going to hold off on upgrading altogether until the next round of product announcements, for that reason.  A Phenom II is not enough of an upgrade to justify going to the trouble.  And AMD doesn't tend to charge obscene prices to the average consumer even when they have the leading processor.   I mean--$999 for an i7 950?   That's a thousand bucks...for the CPU alone.   Intel must be going after the business market, whereas AMD is going after joe user (i.e. us), with their video and more reasonable prices.  If that continues, buy AMD.

on Dec 30, 2009

For example, Jafo spent $3000 AUD on his i7 920 build around the same time, whereas the Phenom II 920 upgrade cost me under $600 AUD. That was for the CPU, a 860w PSU and an extra 2x2gb sticks of Corsair RAM. Thanks to AM2/AM3 backward compatability I was able to keep the same mobo/original RAM and save myself some cash there.

My 'upgrade' was an entirely new machine.  There was no option for adding to the old components as it was a quantum leap in upgrade.....

Lian Li PC-A6010 case [black]

Antec TruePower Quattro 1000w PSU

ASUS P6T-se  X58 i7 MoBo

Intel i7 920 2.66Ghz LGA1366 CPU

OCZ 12G-Triple [6x2G] PC12800 Gold Ram

CoolerMaster V8 CPU Cooler [that bloody big thing]

Vantec EZ2 Sata hot-swap racks x2

1TB Seagate Sata2 7200 HD x2 [for backup/data]

250G Seagate Sata2 7200 HD x2 [for secondary/alternate OS installs]

OCZ Summit SSD 60G [for OS]

ACR-105 Multi card reader

LG Sata DVD-RW x2

XFX 1G GTX285 Black Edition [vid]

Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit RTM.

on Dec 30, 2009

my current rig is one based on an i7-860, asus p7p55d deluxe, 8 gigs of corsair dominator, corsair hx850, and sapphire 5890 configuration. for a customer last night, i built a rig based around an amd 965 cpu and asus's top 790 chipset based mobo, 8 gigs of corsair dominator, same gpu and psu i have. i'll take my i7-860 rig anytime. don't get me wrong, that 965 is sweet and cost less than my rig did but mine is better. even ben, the customer, agrees. 

for those saying the 1366 socket systems are the way to go based on future upgrading, you know virtually everyone of you are going to buy a new mobo and ram when you upgrade the cpu anyway. chances are, you won't upgrade for a couple years or more. by then, you'll want a new mobo, ram, psu, gpu, and case to go along with the new cpu.

on Dec 30, 2009


  However, instead of trying to purchase everything in the one go, I'll pick up the case, HDD's, ROM's, sound and graphics cards along the way.  That way it'll just be the CPU, RAM and mobo when the time comes/I've saved enough.
 

This really is not a good way to buy a computer.  Prices on everything for computer components trend downward over time.  If you pick up a graphics card (say, a GTX 260) right now, but pick up the rest of your computer four months later, chances are that the very same graphics card you purchased will be significantly cheaper by the time you actually build your computer.

 

Assuming you aren't the kind of person that will just blow money being saved, it is (almost) always vastly superior to save whatever your budget is, and then spend it all at the same time.

 

The only exceptions being one-time style deals (If you can get a GTX 260 for half of street price today, then do it!)

Yeah, you're probably right.. particularly when it comes to the graphics card price.   The GTX295 is running at around $595 to $665 AUD at present, and it will come down in price by the time I'm ready to build, so I shall hold off of getting that until I'm ready to purchase the CPU, mobo and RAM.  However, the other components (case, HDD's and ROM's, etc, are fairly much static in price here, unless there's a special, so I will still collect those along the way.  I use PriceSpy to keep an eye on things, so I can pounce on really good deals when they're available.  For example, I saw a Creative X-Fi Xtreme Gamer Pro on special for just $75 AUD the other day... I paid around $135 for mine, which is still about the going price, normally.

My 'upgrade' was an entirely new machine. There was no option for adding to the old components as it was a quantum leap in upgrade.....

I realise that, Jafo, but my comparison was moreso to demonstrate what I could afford at the time... which was just a partial upgrade of a better processor, a higher rated PSU and some extra RAM.  I was able to do that because of the Phenom II's backward compatability.  Therefore it was the most economical way for me to access greater power than what my AMD Athlon x2 6400 gave me.  Had I been able to go with a complete new build at the time I most definitely would have gone with the i7 and forgot entirely about doing a piecemeal upgrade.

A Phenom II is not enough of an upgrade to justify going to the trouble.

Now that entirely depends on what you'd be upgrading from, doesn't it??  I went from a dual core 6400 @ 3.3 to a Phenom II quad @ 2.88, and the difference is significant and well worth it.  So anyone on a lower rated AMD CPU  is going to notice a distinct power and speed improvement.  That is not to say, however, that anyone with a low-end Intel dual or quad core would benefit from a Phenom quad.  By the time they paid for a new mobo to match it, they'd probably be better off going for a same socket upgrade, something like an Intel Core 2 Q9650 @ 3.0ghz, perhaps.

on Dec 30, 2009

Now that entirely depends on what you'd be upgrading from, doesn't it?? I went from a dual core 6400 @ 3.3 to a Phenom II quad @ 2.88

Whereas I went from a P4 3.0 to an i7 920  [there are probably at least 2 possible steps inbetween]....

on Dec 30, 2009


Now that entirely depends on what you'd be upgrading from, doesn't it?? I went from a dual core 6400 @ 3.3 to a Phenom II quad @ 2.88
Whereas I went from a P4 3.0 to an i7 920  [there are probably at least 2 possible steps inbetween]....

In that context, I also skipped two possible steps in between... the Athon II's and the original Phenoms.  The advantage with my upgrade, however, was the backwards compatabilty of the Phenom II with my existing mobo... otherwise I would have been waiting quite a bit longer, perhaps another year to do a completely new build... an i7 920, of course.

Still, I am quite happy with my Phenom II upgrade, it performs well enough for my needs, and now that I've got it overclocked from 2.88 to 3.22, it zips along nicely.  It will become my second rig when I've built the i7, however, and my current spare rig, the AMD Athlon x2 6400 @ 3.2 will be given to my sister.... anything and everything of use gets recycled in my family, and it would be a significant upgrade from her P4 (476 socket) @ 2.2ghz

 

on Dec 31, 2009

I have been running the Core i7 920 socket 1366  for about a year now and love it, but i also am running a Core i7 860 socket 1156, and this thing is quite spectacular, I have found that the core i7 860 handles overclocking better than the 920, but thats me i would buy the core 17 860 1156 before i bought the i7 920

on Dec 31, 2009

I have been running the Core i7 920 socket 1366 for about a year now and love it, but i also am running a Core i7 860 socket 1156, and this thing is quite spectacular, I have found that the core i7 860 handles overclocking better than the 920, but thats me i would buy the core 17 860 1156 before i bought the i7 920

This is quite interesting indeed... given the i7 860 is somewhat cheaper than the 920.  If there's not a lot of difference between the standard clock speeds it'd be worth looking into, and being that it overclocks really well, it may well be that it's a better prospect than the i7 920.

Hmmm, now you've got me thinking.

on Dec 31, 2009

The Phenom II upgrade has some good bang for the buck, but the issue is the timing.   AMD is right in between product releases.   If you can wait till the next release, both that and the Phenom II will both be better deals then.   IMO the best bang for the buck at the moment is your monitor.  And maybe Wireless N (depending on your situation), and maybe a computer desk to go with your monitor(s).   A Phenom II rig, already a good deal, still runs around $700 just for what goes inside the case.  For $200, you can upgrade that 17" CRT to a sweet 22" flat screen.   And then as a bonus you can even keep that 17" as a second monitor, depending on your video and your furniture situation.  Wireless N doesn't really apply to everybody, but if it does it's like tripling your internet for under $100.  That's practically free.  Then later in like 6 months you can get the Phenom II rig for $500 and plug it into your monitors. 

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